Expressed concerns over the scope of work that the vendors are performing with employees in the HES program, work relating to the combustion testing of fossil fuel heating appliances.

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Permalink Reply by Michael Dunseith on May 17, 2011 at 4:22pm

Do you think that they will allow BPI certified personal  to CAZ test any time soon?

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Permalink Reply by Gary Baggett on May 18, 2011 at 6:09am

As of right now the answer is no, but that may change after the meeting next Monday. I'll be going to the meeting on the 23rd and at least will be representing independant contractors looking to test properly. The head of the board from the Consumer Protection Agency told me yesterday that he doesn't believe taking a BPI class is enough to learn how to test. I don't agree but I'll be present on Monday to voice mu opinoun

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Permalink Reply by Sean Lintow Sr on May 18, 2011 at 6:46pm

That is in-line with many others states and quite honestly a smart choice. While I know plenty of BPI or RESNET individuals more than qualified to do the work, that doesn't apply to all of them much less the majority of them. Shoot I had two different versions on how to perform the test given by two different instructors - one left off a few important steps, while the other one said all types of flues should be drilled

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Permalink Reply by Michael Dunseith on May 18, 2011 at 7:31pm

Sean,

2 different instructors and 2 different ways to do CAZ testing? Was that for each of your BPI certs?

I'm curious as to where you received your training.  Did you contact BPI regarding the poor qualifications of the trainers? As a super proctor I see many new students as well as BPI certified professionals that that have been trained by so call industry leaders and do not have a clue as to what or why they do certain tests. The industry grew so fast that many there are quite a few groups out there in it for the money and teaching to the test. Many hire anyone that has a certification even if they just received it and their last job was flipping burgers. Its one thing to have a few new people out there not sure of what they are doing but to have instructors teaching large groups wrong is scary. Its up to people like you to keep BPI informed to unqualified instructors passing out inaccurate information. BPI cant be everywhere but I know they are interested in maintaining high caliber professionals in the Home Performance industry.

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Permalink Reply by Sean Lintow Sr on May 18, 2011 at 8:00pm

Michael, that's correct - one for BA & the other for Envelope

The trainers & stuff were blogged about here: http://blog.sls-construction.com/tag/bpi (towards the bottom) which was pretty hard to do as the last thing you want to do is tick off your instructor that is testing you later. Shoot, I missed the missing steps from the first instructor - it wasn't till the second one that I had a "wait a sec, you do what" moment

As for the points you make about the training & issues - no argument and thus my comments on many not being qualified. As for informing BPI - I know they read the articles, but personally they appear to be more concerned about their logo than fixing issues.

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Permalink Reply by John M on May 19, 2011 at 8:45am

Installing a carbon monoxide detector in the CAZ is the optimal long term health and safety solution - you never know when a squirrel or 'coon will jump into a chinmey! Of course if you want to short term test for combustion appliance efficiency to upsell a more efficent unit, CAZ testing is great. 

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Permalink Reply by Alice La Pierre on May 19, 2011 at 9:22am

I'd have to agree that there seems to be a wide variety of, shall we say, styles of CAZ testing out there among the HP Contractors.  I've been monitoring an energy program for work, and I'm amazed at the differences in approach by contractors. When questioned, each one said that this was the way they were trained.  So, there is something going on with the trainers, whether they are BPI, or some other org's trainers (Build it Green, or ?).  It made me realize, though, that when I was going to hire someone to do my own house with its quirky antique water heater, that I wanted the company that I observed to provide the safest, most methodical approach.  It would be interesting to see what happens if the Heating, Piping and Cooling Work Examining Board decides that BPI cert. is not enough, and what impact that would have on the industry here on the west coast.  And I agree, a propert CO monitor that tracks CO levels, and provides warning alerts, as opposed to letting you know that you should be sick or dead by now, would be the ideal product to have in every home.  I certainly have one.

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Permalink Reply by Gary Baggett on May 19, 2011 at 11:27am

BPI certainly does care about it's reputation and states that it does not teach, but yet sets standards. Every BPI certified auditor very well should know the proper procedure, but as Sean stated, did not learn properly from Clean Edison. Yes, that should be reported to BPI. Sean, you seem to think that BPI is not so concerned about it's training affiliates and I would dissagree. They are presently putting together a Q&A structure for the training affiliates that will be taking effect soon. As Mike stated, BPI has grown faster than anyone expected this last year, which in large part goes to the Home Star legislation that never passed. Getting back to basic's, if anyone has taken a BA course and didn't learn CAZ testing, then I would hope they are smart enough to not be testing! Sean, I read your blog about Clean Edison and I agree with you. I'm not sure where their priorities are centered, the industry or the profits. As far as Connecticut is concerned, I do indeed hope something changes and we are allowed to drill. After all, that is what we are talking about here. The state won't allow us to drill into flue's, although many are already drilled pror to us arriving. The state wants drilling to be done by licensed Heating contractors. I've been building for 27 years and have been into building performance enough years that yes, I know the proper locations and know how to drill and what not to drill into. Again, if someone has questions, then they shouldn't be doing it, that's just common sense. States have been changing their views on this recently and I think Connecticut will also. We shall see!

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Permalink Reply by Michael Dunseith on May 19, 2011 at 12:26pm

 

One thing to remember, a one week course some times less doesn’t make anyone an expert. Its basic knowledge!

BPI promotes working within your limits of professional competency. If you don’t know what you’re doing – Please, DON'T DO IT!

And just because it’s on YouTube doesn’t mean its right!

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Permalink Reply by Gary Baggett on May 19, 2011 at 12:30pm

I have to find bifocals to read what your saying...what happened to your font size? All joking aside, you couldn't be any more correct Mike!

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Permalink Reply by Mike Gilluly on May 19, 2011 at 6:46pm

 

Thanks for posting this. Very Interesting, A large number of oil systems have test holes in flues already, 95% otherwise try to get probe down into undiluted gases.

 Yes, Theres been ongoing concern re air sealing and combustion safety by HES vendors.

 WX audits dont require CAZ or worst case, only combusiton analysis and draft.

The state doesnt allow air sealing when CFM50 is under 2000.   (thats debatable b/c of BPI standards)

Last week through DSS, we were very fortuanate to have Pure Energy Coach come up to conduct training on air sealing and combustion safety specifically. One of my comments to an associate was that HES vendors and oil contractors should've been present...the training was extremely valuable. We see and hear  first hand what oil guys are do to peoples heating systems and rarley provide actual combusition gas results with a CTT.

 

I'm gonna give you a call tomorrow. I'd like to attend the hearing.

 

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Permalink Reply by John M on May 19, 2011 at 7:14pm

Don't forget BPI guidelines only appiy to the Comprehensive Home Assesement, or CHA, which is part of the Home Performance with Energy Star program, a performance based program which mandates a full energy model with test in / test out. WAP, HES, Home TuneUp, HERS ratings, etc. aren't HPwES so BPI doesn't apply.    

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